Animal-Based vs Plant-Based, part 1.5. My response to Joel Fuhrman

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Paul Saladino1h 39m · 2021-05-11

Claims Made

161

Claims Supported

86

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53%

Support rate

86 of 161 claims supported

86 supported75 partial / not

Claims from this content

129

Well SupportedRandomized controlled trials showing that red meat is not inflammatory should be considered as part of the overall body of evidence.Not SupportedFiber has not been shown to increase microbial diversity in the gut, and removing fiber does not decrease microbial diversity.Well SupportedThe longevity observed in Loma Linda, California, is likely due to the avoidance of tobacco and alcohol by Seventh-day Adventists, not the avoidance of meat.Well SupportedHistorical Okinawan centenarians were not vegans or vegetarians, and pork was a significant dietary component.Well Supported

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A. Volkovreader

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Bookmarking — the dossier-vs-overview split is the right call. Most of the time I want overview; sometimes I want receipts.

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Would love a "what would change this verdict" RSS feed. Sign me up if it exists.

Four out of five Blue Zones consume significant amounts of meat central to their culture and traditional dishes.

Well SupportedRed meat intake was inversely associated with cardiovascular disease mortality in men and cancer mortality in women in Asian countries.

Partially SupportedGut bacteria convert choline and carnitine into TMA, which the liver oxidizes to TMAO, a contributor to atherosclerosis.

Well SupportedThere is no evidence that meat is harmful for humans, and interventional trials with increased amounts of animal foods show benefits.

Well SupportedHumans evolved to thrive by consuming readily available whole foods, particularly meat and organs, rather than supplements or a wide variety of plant foods.

Well SupportedBeef fat improves apoptosis and decreases aberrant crypt foci formation relative to plant-based oil in rat colon studies.

Well SupportedMeat has been a central part of human evolution and is intuitively perceived as beneficial due to its nutrient richness.

Well SupportedThe Hadza, a hunter-gatherer tribe, consume meat daily and are free from chronic diseases such as diabetes, obesity, autoimmune disease, depression, and cancer.

Well SupportedThe leucine content of food is the primary factor for triggering muscle synthesis, not just the total protein amount.

Well SupportedPaul Saladino maintains low hs-CRP, fibrinogen, and fasting insulin, suggesting no excess glycation or endothelial damage despite high carbohydrate intake.

Well SupportedVegetarians have reduced carnitine levels and transport, which is problematic as carnitine is essential for human functioning.

Well SupportedRemoving seed oils and high-fructose processed sugars from the diet are key strategies for improving metabolic health.

Well SupportedIncreasing lean red meat intake by replacing carbohydrates does not elevate markers of oxidative stress and inflammation.

Well SupportedDesiccated organ supplements can help people by providing an easy way to consume organs.

Not SupportedIn vitro studies on compounds in red meat often use conditions and doses not relevant to normal human dietary intake.

Well SupportedReplacing 600-800 grams of whole grain carbohydrates with red meat in diabetics improved insulin sensitivity and reduced inflammation.

Well SupportedPoor sperm quality in some Seventh-day Adventists may be due to plant pesticides and mold toxins in their diet.

Well SupportedInsulin stimulates mTOR more significantly and for a longer duration than leucine.

Well SupportedLeucine is the main anabolic component of protein and a potent stimulator of muscle protein synthesis by activating the mTOR pathway.

Not SupportedThe data linking high protein intake in individuals under 50 to increased mortality is not convincing and may be attributable to confounders.

Well SupportedBlue blocking glasses can protect the suprachiasmatic nucleus and circadian rhythms.

Partially SupportedElevated TMAO levels are likely caused by kidney disease and insulin resistance, not the other way around.

Partially SupportedSaturated fat from animals does not cause inflammation or endotoxemia in individuals with a healthy microbiome but can cause issues with dysbiosis.

Not SupportedStrictly limiting protein intake due to concerns about mTOR activation may lead to sarcopenia and bone mineral loss.

Partially SupportedIn some Asian cultures, meat consumption correlates with affluence and lower rates of breast cancer and heart attacks, suggesting lifestyle factors are influential.

Partially SupportedTwo billion people worldwide suffer from micronutrient deficiencies, largely due to insufficient consumption of animal source foods.

Not SupportedIncreasing polyunsaturated fat intake while decreasing saturated fat intake can lead to an increase in oxidized LDL and lipoprotein(a).

Partially SupportedNHANES energy intake data is inaccurate for a majority of respondents.

Not SupportedHigh animal protein intake does not excessively elevate IGF-1, and IGF-1's role in promoting cancer development has not been conclusively shown.

Partially SupportedValter Longo's study suggests individuals under 65 who ate less protein had better outcomes, while those over 65 had worse outcomes.

Partially SupportedJoel Fuhrman pressure cooks beans to detoxify anti-nutrients like lectins.

Partially SupportedPaul Saladino's gut microbiome inflammation score is minimal on a carnivorous diet with honey.

Partially SupportedLong-term studies consistently link higher plant protein and lower animal protein intake to a longer life.

Partially SupportedVegetarian death rates are similar to the general population when controlling for healthy behaviors.

Partially SupportedThe claim that saturated fat in ketogenic or carnivore diets creates lipid rafts that increase postprandial endotoxemia is a point of contention.

Partially SupportedPaul Saladino's recent LDL was 533 mg/dL with a coronary artery calcium score of zero.

Well SupportedIGF-1 plays a crucial role in muscle repair, muscle growth, preserving muscle mass, and neurogenesis.

Partially SupportedProtein and carbohydrate intake are recommended for activating mTOR, and insulin response to these macronutrients will also activate mTOR.

Partially SupportedHeme iron is essential for making red blood cells and is the primary treatment for iron deficiency anemia.

Partially SupportedAnimal source foods are recommended by the World Health Organization as the best source of high-quality, nutrient-rich food for children aged 6 to 23 months.

Partially SupportedInterventional studies show red meat or organs are beneficial for humans, do not increase inflammatory markers like CRP, and have evolutionary precedent.

Partially SupportedPlant protein intake is associated with lower all-cause and cardiovascular mortality.

Partially SupportedAnimal protein intake does not significantly increase inflammatory markers like TGF-beta 1 or calprotectin compared to plant protein intake.

Partially SupportedInterventional trials in people with liver disease show that increased amounts of animal foods reduce liver fat and inflammation.

Partially SupportedInsulin is a stronger trigger of mTOR signaling than leucine in human myotubes.

Partially SupportedNitroso compounds formed after ingesting red meat have different chemistries than tumorogenic end nitroso species that form DNA adducts.

Partially SupportedVegetarians had a higher rate of colorectal cancer in the EPIC-Oxford study.

Not SupportedThe claim that red meat is inflammatory and harmful due to specific compounds is not well-substantiated by current evidence for typical human dietary intake.

Partially SupportedA study showed no difference in inflammation when comparing animal protein and plant protein.

Not SupportedEpidemiological studies can be subject to biases including underdiagnosis, misdiagnosis, researcher bias, and healthy user bias.

Well SupportedMalignant cancer, including pancreatic cancer, was lower in fish eaters and low meat eaters compared to regular meat eaters.

Not SupportedPaul Saladino believes there are no good interventional studies showing that red meat or saturated fat from red meat is harmful to humans.

Partially SupportedInsulin levels will rise postprandially even when consuming fat and meat, preventing a chronically low insulin state.

Partially SupportedA high wheat fiber diet reduced hemoglobin A1c by 0.3% in individuals with type 2 diabetes.

Partially SupportedIn individuals over 65, high protein intake was associated with reduced cancer and overall mortality.

Partially SupportedA balance between mTOR being on and off can be achieved daily, even with time-restricted feeding, by managing insulin signals and avoiding insulin resistance.

Well SupportedEssential amino acids are vital for building enzymes and proteins.

Well SupportedCold exposure can enhance life.

Partially SupportedThe N-nitroso compounds formed in humans after ingesting red meat have different chemistries than those typically studied in vitro or in animal models.

Partially SupportedThe cardiovascular health of the Hadza people is exemplary.

Not SupportedThe idea that meat is harmful due to gut-derived metabolic products like choline and carnitine is incorrect, as these are helpful for humans and TMAO is not harmful.

Not SupportedBeans can cause gas, bloating, and contain anti-nutrients like lectins that should be detoxified.

Partially SupportedIsocaloric diets high in animal or plant protein reduce liver fat and inflammation in individuals with type 2 diabetes, independent of body weight.

Not SupportedA 0.5% reduction in hemoglobin A1c from a low GI legume diet is not profoundly impressive for managing type 2 diabetes.

Not SupportedRelying heavily on observational epidemiology, particularly when data like NHANES is known to be inaccurate, undermines the validity of arguments based on such data.

Not SupportedA reduction of 14 mg/dL in average blood glucose is not a significant improvement for individuals with high average blood glucose levels.

Partially SupportedAnimal studies generally do not support the implication from epidemiological studies that red meat increases colon cancer risk.

Not SupportedThe health and longevity benefits of nuts, seeds, and beans are not impressive and they are not nutrient-dense foods.

Not SupportedThere are no interventional studies showing red meat or animal fats like tallow are harmful to humans.

Partially SupportedReducing red meat intake and increasing fiber intake has no additional beneficial impact on cardiovascular risk parameters when caloric restriction is applied.

Partially SupportedBeef and lamb did not induce activation of toll-like receptors or cytokine secretion in human monocytes in vitro.

Partially SupportedCaloric restriction leads to marked improvement in glucose metabolism, regardless of diet composition, in metabolically unhealthy individuals.

Partially SupportedAvoiding alcohol and tobacco, and having community and shared belief, are more likely drivers of longevity than dietary patterns like vegetarianism.

Partially SupportedEating meat or any protein increases IGF-1 levels, with leucine specifically triggering IGF-1 and muscle growth/repair.

Partially SupportedMicronutrient and fiber-rich beans are linked to improved blood pressure, LDL cholesterol, body weight, insulin sensitivity, and enhanced lifespan.

Not SupportedAssociations between high protein intake and increased mortality/cancer/diabetes in younger adults may be due to unhealthy user bias.

Not SupportedAssociations between high protein intake and negative health outcomes may be attenuated if some protein is plant-based, suggesting a potential misunderstanding of protein quality and leucine content.

Not SupportedExcessive animal protein does not consistently elevate IGF-1.

Partially SupportedA 2016 JAMA study showed no association between animal protein intake and all-cause mortality.

Partially SupportedBeef and lamb do not stimulate toll-like receptors.

Partially SupportedThe terms 'linked' or 'associated' in epidemiological studies do not imply an interventional effect.

Partially SupportedTMAO is formed in the liver when the enzyme FMO3 acts on TMA, which is produced in the gut from choline and carnitine.

Partially SupportedFMD is a stronger predictor of future cardiovascular disease events in patients with existing cardiovascular disease than in healthy individuals.

Partially SupportedConsuming red meat, processed meats, or a high animal protein diet has a profoundly damaging effect on overall health and longevity.

Partially SupportedPaul Saladino challenged Joel Fuhrman to provide interventional studies showing harm from red meat.

Partially SupportedThe FMO3 enzyme in the liver, which produces TMAO, can be upregulated in states of diabetes, potentially leading to increased TMAO production.

Partially SupportedAn animal-based diet can lead to very good body composition in individuals who do not supplement with synthetic protein or use steroids.

Partially SupportedHigher intake of plant protein sources, such as seeds and nuts, is associated with reduced cardiovascular disease risk and longevity.

Partially SupportedRuminants grazing on land contribute to a sustainable ecosystem.

Not SupportedThe association between TMAO and worse cardiometabolic health outcomes may be due to reverse causality or confounding.

Not SupportedEpidemiological studies on diet and mortality can be misleading due to confounding factors.

Partially SupportedA diet of whole grains improved gut microbiome diversity compared to red meat over a three-week period.

Not SupportedLow glycemic index diets, including legume-based diets, offer only slight improvements in cardiovascular risk factors like systolic blood pressure.

Not SupportedReplacing animal protein with plant protein in epidemiological studies involves data wrangling and conjecture.

Not SupportedThe pro-inflammatory compound TMAO has not been shown to be pro-inflammatory in humans.

Partially SupportedStudies by Joel Fuhrman referenced in JAMA Internal Medicine and General Internal Medicine are epidemiological, not interventional.

Not SupportedAnimal and in vitro studies using high doses of red meat components are not sufficient to conclude red meat promotes cancer at usual dietary intakes.

Not SupportedThe mechanisms linking nitroso compounds in meat to cancer are shaky and not the same as problematic tumorogenic compounds.

Not SupportedDNA adducts formed in vitro at high concentrations are not a reliable indicator of colorectal cancer risk.

Partially SupportedSaturated fat from butter may be harmful by creating lipid rafts and endotoxemia, dependent on underlying gut dysbiosis.

Partially SupportedA UK study found vegetarians and fish eaters had lower mortality from malignant cancer, and fish eaters had higher deaths from circulatory disease.

Partially SupportedImpaired flow-mediated dilation in individuals with diabetes is a constant state, distinct from transient post-meal impairments.

Partially SupportedA 1% reduction in hemoglobin A1c is equivalent to approximately 14 mg/dL reduction in average blood glucose over 90 days.

Partially SupportedTMAO is not harmful to humans and has been found in animal models to decrease diastolic hypertension and heart failure.

Partially SupportedMechanisms by which meat may be harmful, such as N-nitroso compounds and heme iron, may not be relevant in rats or mammals.

Partially SupportedRed meat consumption is associated with increased risk of cancers and cardiovascular issues, with plant-based diets suggested for better outcomes.

Partially SupportedIn a rat colon study, protein source or interactions between fat and protein sources had no significant effects on aberrant crypt foci.

Partially SupportedPork and some turkey induced cytokine secretion in an in vitro study on immune activation, while beef, lamb, sausage, chicken nuggets, pork pie, egg, and milk did not.

Partially SupportedThe quantity of red meat consumed does not significantly alter outcomes when seed oils are reduced.

Partially SupportedPlant protein is associated with lower mortality in individuals with unhealthy lifestyle risk factors.

Partially SupportedThe association between plant protein and better health outcomes may be due to healthy user bias.

Partially SupportedBritish vegetarians have mortality rates similar to comparable non-vegetarians, suggesting lifestyle factors may explain perceived vegetarian benefits.

Not SupportedReducing essential amino acid intake may not promote longevity due to the role of mTOR, IGF-1, and leucine.

Partially SupportedChocolate, bread, and some hard and soft cheeses induced significant cytokine secretion in an in vitro immune activation study.

Partially SupportedExchanging saturated fats for omega-6 polyunsaturated fats in a mixed meal may decrease postprandial lipemia and markers of inflammation in overweight men.

Partially SupportedButter fat may increase endotoxemia in individuals with pre-existing dysbiosis, but not in healthy individuals.

Partially SupportedHealth benefits of low-GI diets may be due to lower calorie intake or increased fiber, rather than specific food types.

Partially SupportedThere is a bi-directional communication between the gut and metabolic health, with metabolic dysfunction potentially leading to gut dysbiosis.

Partially SupportedLimiting animal protein intake without using plant-based protein supplements can lead to low muscle mass.

Partially SupportedStudies consistently link greater red meat consumption to a greater risk of premature death.

Partially SupportedPaul Saladino's fasting IGF-1 level was less than 100 when eating a carnivorous diet.

Partially SupportedReducing essential amino acid intake may promote longevity.

Partially SupportedAnimal models suggest linoleic acid can cause gut dysbiosis, and omega-3 fish oil may not attenuate this effect, potentially causing issues with lipopolysaccharide and endotoxemia.

Not SupportedExcess omega-6 fatty acids from soybean oil may damage the hypothalamus, affecting gene expression and the oxytocin system, potentially contributing to obesity and satiety issues.

Partially SupportedConcerns about cooking byproducts like TMAO, heme iron, and nitroso compounds in meat-based diets for colon cancer or longevity are unfounded.